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  1. #1
    Senior Member Glider's Avatar
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    Slight hesitation at 2800 rpm?

    My 2016 Iron 883 hesitates a bit at 2800 rpm in all gears. The it surges again above 3000 rpm. I suggest it might be exhaust related as before I opened up the stock pipes the 'flat spot' was 2500 rpm. It's only a small blip then I drive out of it on to 4000 and so. Any ideas? At first I thought it was the rev limiter but I can ride through it so not really. Anyone else experience this? The bike accelerates really well but it's just not smooth all the way through. Possibly a fuel processor would even this out but it's not that massive an issue to go to the bother and expense I feel. Responses welcome.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Glider's Avatar
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    I understand the XL-ViED-14 from DK Custom can smooth out running. Has anyone used one?

  3. #3
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    I heard of a few on the sportster sickness uk page on fb who have used them and said they got good running from them as an interim before getting a fuel tuner. I would say go for an FP3 or similar and get it fueled properly... irrespective of whether you want full satge 1 or not, it will make your bike run smoother

  4. #4
    Senior Member 100thmonkey's Avatar
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    Fuel pak 3 or a good dyno will sort most all that out.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  5. #5
    Senior Member bluenose-1956's Avatar
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    The XL-XiED-14 are manufactured by Nightrider are plug and play fuel enrichment devices which fool the bikes ECU into thinking that the engine is running running too lean, so the ECU injects 8% more fuel into the engine. The extra fuel helps the motor to run smoother and cooler, they're especially useful in hot Summer weather wen a stock motor is likely to overheat. They're a cheap alternative to a FP3 or Power Commander V, but they have limitations as they're not adjustable. XL-XiED-14 are available from H&C Custom for £99.99.

    I have used XL-XiED-14 leads on my 2011 Iron, they worked as they should but I removed them after six months, I'll soon be installing my Screamin' Eagle Race Tuner instead.

    xied_a_450.jpg
    Last edited by bluenose-1956; 04-16-2018 at 04:56 PM.

  6. #6
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    I used the XL-XIEDs for a short while before getting a proper dyno tune as mine was running dangerously lean and they did the job well enough but they should be considered an interim measure only. Bear in mind, all these do is to richen the mixture at all revs, so if your flat spot is at a particularly weak spot in fuelling it will richen that up, but run richer everywhere else too. They're better suited for people who use stock pipes and faster flow air filters where back pressures have been factory mapped. When you alter the back pressure by changing pipes it is dependant upon pipe length, cross sectional area and baffle design as to where the lean/rich points might occur in fuelling and how much back pressure is there. Longer term, there is no substitution for a dyno-tuned fuel map, and the two tuners worth buying are the SE Super-Tune (pro) or Power Commander V. budget £100 to £150 for dyno time.

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  8. #7
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    I just got an adjustable spanner on the dreadful 'hero blobs' and then adjusted the suspesnion as per Bud's post from the bottom of this page. (Sorry, no idea how to link to a specific post.) Rain stopped so I whizzed out for half an hour and found this dreadful 'stuttering' between 2000-3000 rpm. Frustrating - and familiar because the brand new Superlow did it too. (It was much less obvious with the Forty-Eight.) I thought it was me at first - new Harley boy and everything. But no! It's yet another Harley 'quirk'! ('Quirk' being a euphemism for 'expensive design flaw'?!)

    I was going to start a thread, but lo! There's already one here. (Though not just at 2800 rpm for me.) So Bud, you're saying all I have to do is spend another ton on a fuel tuner device, plus the same again to get it working properly? To be clear, I truly lurrrve my new Custom, but Harley's design ethic of 'make a cheap, crappy one and let the customer mend it' has started to get to me!

    I am now going to Google 'SE Super-Tune' & 'Power Commander'. Then I'm going to begin drinking heavily.

    What a world!

    Cheers,

    Chris

  9. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckhornBud View Post
    ... there is no substitution for a dyno-tuned fuel map, and the two tuners worth buying are the SE Super-Tune (pro) or Power Commander V. budget £100 to £150 for dyno time.
    £400 for a fuel tuner? Four hundred quid?! Are you kidding me? What are you trying to do to me Bud? Is this revenge for the panniers? Aaahhhh... All I want to do is ride my Harley!

    Seriously Bud, let's play nice; my bike's not running well at lower revs. I don't want to change the exhaust, I don't want a new air filter, I don't want to increase power and I don't want to do race days. I just wanna ride about without the engine strugglin' between 2-3000 rpm.

    Could I just get the bike re-tuned/re-mapped? I know you had a horror story regarding your re-mapping, but would Riders (for instance) do an 'oridnary' dyno doobry? (I don't want to increase the fuel consumption or power - other than torque, perhaps.)

    How glad am I that I started drinking already?

    Cheers,

    Chris

  10. #9
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    You have a fuel injected bike and so the only way to alter the fuel flow is electronically.
    The tuner add-ons are able to reprogram the fuel table to give an increase or decrease in fuel mixture. On a dyno the clever chap is able to set every point in the table throttle position / engine revs to get the best from the engine.
    Now it is clear that as this is quite technical those that sell devices make as much as possible from them. Here is the kicker, unless you can find someone with a Power Vision tuner the tuner you buy gets locked to that bike and cannot be used on another.
    Power Vision allows dealers to purchase a user license per bike so is cheaper than purchasing the whole device.

    Initially if you go with the Harley option you buy the tuner and the dealer will provide the hook up cables and expertise. If you want to be able to do it yourself then you will need to buy the cables to hook the device up to your computer. (I think that's how it works)

    The V&H FP3 is a DIY device that uses your smart phone for the display and programming.
    There are other devices that offer the DIY option.
    But they all seem to cost circa £400!
    Last edited by Andy from Sandy; 05-25-2018 at 05:58 PM.

  11. #10
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    Hi Chris

    you could get it sorted by some dyno time but as the stock eprom requires a fuel map to tune it, you need a method by which you do this. There's no plug and play unless you go the electronic tuner route (fuelpak etc etc) and no really satisfactory way to iron it all out properly except with dyno time. Whilst you could go to Riders, buy an FP3 and have them fit it and do a generic tune on your bike, you wont be able to do it satisfactorily without dyno time and Riders don't have a dyno....you need to find a local (ish) company that does and that has worked with bikes to do this. Power Commander tuners are the best option as they use a greater number of tuning points and they are dedicated to use with Dynojet Dynamometers. You can use any tuner but most dyno specialists will already be set up with the software to run Power Commanders.

    The issue is that the air cooled motor is getting long in the tooth in terms of its ability to comply with latest Euro emissions regs so the only way they do it is by a combination of adding a restrictive CAT and running the bike quite lean, right in the very spot you don't want it lean" (You'll find that you spend a lot of time between 2K and 3K revs). It's not a problem when cruising or pottering, but when you want instant shove, you have to grab a handful of revs.

    I balked at paying the "Harley Tax" on a brand new bike, but ended up going there. The cheapest (proper) solution is the SE Street Tuner for a few hundred quid plus an hours dyno time. It'll sort your bike, keep it standard and eliminate the flat spot by running the bike richer there (and cooler).

    I tried the XIED solution and it did work after a fashion but ran the bike a little too rich everywhere else, but it removed the flat spot.

    You can get used to the stock bike and really enjoy it...plenty do. Once you've ridden a sorted (stage 1) bike, you'll never go back to a standard one.

    The good thing about a supertuner pro etc is that once you have a map and some dyno time for the standard set up, it's not that much trouble to spend another 30 mins dyno time if you decide on louder pipes or faster airflow. There's no insurance premium to pay either (at least not in my case).

    When you buy a standard Harley, I reckon most need to budget around £400 extra for a tuner and dyno time or £1000 for pipes, air filter, tuner and dyno time.

    That's why a lot of people buy stage 1 bikes used (way better value as someone else has taken the hit) rather than standard bikes but whether you have the work done does largely depend on your riding style.

    You have a great bike with a good, strong motor. It's capable of more and of better running. To be fair to H-D, they have no choice but to comply with emissions regs and the true cost of buying a Sportster will be ticket price plus a grand if you want a stage 1 bike, or ticket price plus several hundred for one that fuels satisfactorily wrt satisfactory riding.

    Their newer models are all designed from the ground up with current emissions regs in mind so run well as standard (M8 engines). The Evo was designed when standards were not as strict and whilst they have improved them with fuel injection (and it is a good system) the motor needs a handful of throttle as standard to get the best from it whereas a stage 1 motor will pull willingly from just about any revs in any gear.

    Oh....Andy is right about the cables. I have a set myself so if you need dyno time I am willing to lend them to you should you go the Harley tuner route.
    Last edited by BuckhornBud; 05-25-2018 at 06:13 PM.

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